[FIRST DAY]

Mr. Speaker

Before I call those hon. Members who are to propose and second the motion on the Loyal Address, it may be for the convenience of the House if I announce the subjects which I understand are suggested for the various debates : Friday 26 June, foreign affairs; Monday 29 June, social and economic divisions of the nations and regions of Britain; Tuesday 30 June, deprivation and inequality of opportunity; Wednesday 1 July, Britain's cities, local services and education; Thursday 2 July, the use of national resources.

2.38 pm
Mr. Churchill (Davyhulme)

I beg to move, That an humble address be presented to Her Majesty, as follows: Most Gracious Sovereign, We, Your Majesty's most dutiful and loyal subjects, the Commons of the United Kingdom of Great Britain and Northern Ireland in Parliament assembled, beg leave to offer our humble thanks to Your Majesty for the Gracious Speech which Your Majesty has addressed to both Houses of Parliament. The Gracious Speech refers to Her Majesty's proposed visits to Canada and Australia in the coming Session, and I know that it would be the wish of the whole House that I place on record our appreciation of Her Majesty's tireless devotion to the interests of her subjects in this country and throughout the Commonwealth. We wish Her Majesty God speed on her journeys and a safe return.

In moving this Loyal Address, may I be the first in this Parliament to congratulate my right hon. Friend the Prime Minister on her achievement in securing a third consecutive term of office, a feat unequalled since the days of Lord Liverpool in 1820. On that occasion, moving the Loyal Address, Sir Edward Knatchbull spoke of the "respect and confidence" in which our nation was held by foreign nations. It gave him great satisfaction that the estimates for the public service had been formed on the "strictest principles of economy" and that, in regard to defence, "whatever opinions might be entertained on this subject, he was sure that the House would agree to give the support to Government which the safety of the country required". I know that those are sentiments dear to my right hon. Friend's heart and to that of the House as a whole.

I draw the attention of those self-important television pundits who have recently been pontificating and who have suggested that my right hon. Friend might lay down her burden during this Parliament to the fact that, at the time of the next election, in about 1991, my right hon. Friend will be the same age as Mr. Churchill was when he formed his first Administration. While not wishing to depress the Leader of the Opposition, I am sure that he will be aware that even as we enter the next millenium, my right hon. Friend will still be two years younger than Mr. Churchill when he formed his second Administration.

I am deeply conscious of the honour conferred upon my constituents and upon me in being asked to propose this Loyal Address. I must confess so some amazement that this distinction should fall on me. In casting back through the speeches of those who passed this way before me, a clear pattern emerges — at least in the case of the seconders of the motion. There is little doubt that they, like my hon. Friend the Member for Sherwood (Mr. Stewart), were young men of promise who were destined for high office. Unfortunately, the future of those who had the honour to move the motion seems to have been somewhat less assured.

I am the third generation of my family to have the good fortune to represent an industrial Lancashire seat, and I am proud to wear today the red rose of Lancashire, which precedes by several centuries its more recent usurpation for political purposes. I am privileged to have had the opportunity of representing my Greater Manchester constituency in this House for the past 17 years.

My constituency is an industrial and residential area on the west side of Manchester straddling the river Mersey and bounded on its north side by the Manchester ship canal. The present-day prosperity of my constituency and of the city of Manchester is based to a large degree on the vision of one man — Marshall Stevens who, 100 years ago this year, embarked on the incredibile enterprise of linking Manchester, which is 35 miles inland, with the oceans of the world. It is an awesome sight to see 15,000-tonne ocean-going vessels gliding along the ship canal amid fields of cabbages.

The foundation of Trafford Park — the first and greatest purpose-built industrial estate in the world — was a direct consequence of that vision. The only project that can be compared with it in modern times is the building of the Channel tunnel. Although it was my wife's great-grandfather, Emile d'Erlanger, who founded the original Channel Tunnel Company in 1886, I regret to say that it was my great-grandfather, Lord Randolph Churchill, who two years later was instrumental in defeating the Channel Tunnel Bill. Although the Bill was supported by Mr. Gladstone and by many prominent members of the Liberal and Conservative parties, he managed to kill that Bill with ridicule, pouring scorn upon the provision to install in a Minister's office a button connected to demolition charges at the entrance to the tunnel which could blow it up in an emergency. He questioned who would have the right to push the button, and suggested, mischievously, that the then Member for the City of Westminster, Mr. W. H. Smith, would no doubt be proposing the motion, That the button he now pushed. By such stratagems, the tunnel was delayed for 100 years, but I am delighted to see that it is well under way today.

Trafford Park became the gateway to Europe for many American firms, and in 1911 it was selected by Henry Ford as the site for his first manufacturing plant outside the United States. During the second world war, no fewer than 80,000 people worked in Trafford Park, which became famous for the production of the Lancaster bomber. Since those stern but glorious days, the decline in employment in Trafford Park under successive Governments has been relentless — above all, in consequence of changing technologies.

Today, Britain is experiencing a painful change brought about by what I would call the third industrial revolution in which the production worker is displaced by robots and computers. It is no accident that Scotland, Wales and the north of England — Britain's industrial heartland — have suffered disproportionately in job losses.

No amount of wishful thinking could bring back those labour-intensive production processes. The only answer is to embrace the new technologies, with the aim of becoming world beaters in that area, as we were in the past. Many of our industries are as modern as any in the world. The northern edition of the Daily Telegraph, which used to be printed in the centre of Manchester with a work force of 2,500 using old technology, is now printed in my constituency with a work force of only 425. The House will wish to know that, during a recent visit, I was advised that none of the 425 employees deigns to take a salary as modest as that of a Member of this House.

The key ingredient in the prosperity of Trafford Park, which still employ 25,000 people, is the skill, ingenuity and reliability of the work force. The same holds true for Manchester as a whole, which, excepting only our capital city, stands second to none in the United Kingdom and is today on the up and up. Two years ago, the Government removed many of the artificial restraints on the natural expansion of Manchester airport. As a result, my constituents can fly to twice as many destinations, and we have direct links across the Atlantic as well as to the middle and far east. Manchester has the fastest-growing airport in Europe, with traffic increasing at 16 per cent. a year. That is leading to a resurgence in economic confidence, which is beginning to spread to other parts of the north west. The trend in unemployment is firmly downward, with 35,000 more people in work than a year ago.

As the representative of an urban and industrial constituency, I welcome the Government's wide-ranging plans, contained in the Gracious Speech and covering housing, education and employment, for regenerating the inner cities. My constituents will be delighted at the assurances contained in the Gracious Speech that, in all these policies, the Government will have special regard to the needs of inner cities and that Action will be taken to encourage investment and to increase enterprise and employment in those areas. The problems of industrial decline and urban decay cannot be solved by throwing money about mindlessly. Enough of that is already happening up and down the country, with spendthrift local councils squandering millions of pounds of ratepayers' money at the expense of the jobs that are provided by firms in the inner-city areas, which are driven out of business. A new partnership is needed between central and local government on the one hand, and private enterprise on the other to regenerate the inner cities and provide industry and commerce with new life-blood.

The newly-established Trafford Park Urban Development Corporation is the vanguard of that new partnership. There, the commitment of £160 million — [Interruption]

Mr. Speaker

Order. I am sorry to interrupt the hon. Gentleman. I hope that in this Parliament we shall give Members a fair hearing. The hon. Gentleman should be heard in silence.

Mr. Churchill

The commitment of £160 million of taxpayers' money is expected to generate 10 times that amount from private enterprise and lead to the creation of some 16,000 new jobs in Trafford Park in the years ahead.

Any policy for bringing prosperity and hope back to the inner cities must include measures to protect our people in the inner cities from the violence that strikes fear into their hearts, especially of those who are frail and elderly. It is essential that they should be enabled to go about their lawful occasions in safety and feel secure in their homes. My constituents will wholeheartedly endorse the Government's determination to increase the resources that are available to the police and to establish a national organisation to promote crime prevention. The police are doing a wonderful job in difficult circumstances and are entitled to the gratitude of us all, especially those of us in this House.

Whichever constituency we have the honour to represent, I venture to suggest that there is nothing that takes higher priority in the eyes of those whom we represent than the defence of the realm. Without peace and freedom everything else, over which we meet together in the House to deliberate, becomes irrelevant. The nation as a whole attaches the greatest importance to the assurance that has frst place in the Gracious Speech, namely, that the Government: will stand fully by their obligations to the NATO Alliance. They will sustain Britain's contribution to Western defence by modernising the independent nuclear deterrent through the introduction of the Trident submarine programme and by increasing the effectiveness of the nation's conventional forces. In the nuclear age, those countries that do not possess nuclear weapons or do not have the privilege of belonging to a large and poerful nuclear-backed Alliance, as we do in NATO, are pygmies in defence terms, and are powerless to protect their civilian population from the threat of nuclear attack or blackmail. Even as we move forward in the negotiations between East and West for the reduction of nuclear weapons at intermediate and strategic levels, it is essential to our national security that the United Kingdom maintains the effectiveness of its own systems.

The British people are finding a new self-confidence and Britain is acquiring a new respect in the world. The programme set out in the Gracious Speech underlines the Government's determination to roll forward the frontiers of prosperity to all quarters of our country so that we can truly build one nation.

2.53 pm
Mr. Andy Stewart (Sherwood)

I beg to second the motion.

I am greatly honoured to be chosen to second the moton. However, the real honour is to the historic name of Sherwood and my constituency, which I am proud to represent for a second term.

When I was asked to speak this afternoon, I wondered why I had been chosen. On researching my personal profile, I found that the answer was not there. I was described by some as tall, slim and handsome—sorry, I tell a lie: tall, slim and slightly bald on top-interested in sports, having Victorian values and being a parliamentary orator with the charm and grace of a pneumatic drill. On this important occasion I have left my drill at home.

I have a second reason for pride—I have had the best of both worlds. I was born a Scot and then had the good fortune to live in Nottinghamshire for 26 years. I can recall just a few short years ago when I first entered the House and found my way to the Strangers Bar. [Laughter.] I came into contact with a person who may be known to some right hon. and hon. Members as Mr. Mick McGahey. "Hello Mick," I said, as I would address any fellow Scot, "I'm Andy Stewart and I represent the largest mining constituency in Britain." Mick shook my hand with comradely fervour. "Aye, it's guid tae ken ye, Andy," said he. "Now the bad news, Mick," I said. "I am a Tory." I leave the rest to the imagination of the House.

It is my privilege to follow my eloquent hon. Friend the Member for Davyhulme (Mr. Churchill) and I congratulate him on his speech. His grandfather was the inspiration and leader of this country's fight to preserve democracy and freedom. Recent events in my constituency prove that the will to fight to preserve a system of democracy through the ballot box still burns in Nottinghamshire. Indeed, the courage and determination of the Nottinghamshire coalfield communities will go down in history. But Sherwood has always had strong historical roots, like its major oak in the heart of Sherwood forest which in turn mirrors the stout heart of England.

The Sherwood constituency, unlike its old name, has existed only since 1983 and is made up of one large town, Hucknall, and a series of tightly knit villages, all individual, but linked by one important thread. They are committed, caring communities. Sherwood's collieries are world famous, and Thoresby colliery is our black diamond. Last year Nottinghamshire produced 18.5 million tonnes of coal, and sales injected £750 million into the national and local economy. The pace-setting Nottinghamshire miners' productivity record is now almost equalled by the other coalfields. This remarkable achievement has stabilised energy costs and plays a vital role in the country's fight to kill the evils of inflation—a fight which I am pleased to see will not diminish.

That other great supplier of energy, British Petroleum has its land-based production and exploration headquarters at Eakring. It is where the familiar nodding donkeys were first installed. If it had been necessary, our Eakring oil would have been sufficient to fuel our fighter aircraft for my hon. Friend's grandfather during the Battle of Britain. The House may also be glad to know that the expression "nodding donkeys" did not originate in this Chamber.

But Sherwood does not merely mean coal and oil. Our agriculture provides food. Without Sherwood there would be no Walker's crisps. Our textiles provide clothes. Jaeger exports as far as Japan. Our industries provide transport. Rolls-Royce powers aircraft all over the world. Our tourist industry provides entertainment. The unique £32 million Centre Pares holiday village will open on Saturday, and 400 permanent jobs have been created, not counting the spin-offs for the community. Tourism is the largest potential job creator in this country and the Government's initiatives are widely welcomed.

Robin Hood is not, however, the only famous son of Sherwood. Lord Byron's ancestral home, Newstead Abbey, lies in the constituency. In 1812, after Lord Byron's maiden speech in the other place, Sir Francis Burdett said: It is the best speech by a Lord since Lord knows when. Education is rightly an important feature of the Gracious Speech. The Government intend to give parents the right to make sure that opportunities are available for their children. It is impossible to take advantage of the opportunities offered if children have not received the basic skills to enable them to do so. The Bill will give our children those skills. It is not a privilege that we offer; it is their right. The Conservative Government intend to ensure that right.

Robin Hood would have been merry indeed to hear the tax proposals in the Gracious Speech. He was the original Conservative who devised the system of giving money back to the people. Our methods are slightly different, but the result is the same.

Need I say that I welcome the Government's commitment to support agriculture to enable farmers to diversify. Some of us have already diversified. The constituency has 6,500 hectares of conifers, and I applaud the initiative on deciduous trees set out in the Gracious Speech.

I was also delighted to hear of the proposals for step-by-step progress towards further trade union reforms. The plans to give the union member freedom of choice against the closed shop will go some way towards redressing the balance of power and influence from union bosses to individuals. That power will be given to householders and parents — power to the people — and that is where it belongs.

I pay tribute to the Prime Minister and to her Cabinet and ministerial colleagues for the remarkable transformation that has taken place in this country's economic fortunes and international standing since 1979. Because of this strength of leadership, I am confident about the plans that the Government will follow in the next Parliament, as outlined in the Gracious Speech.

Nationally, the country recorded the largest number of votes for the Conservative party since the war, and I know that the country has put its trust in us. With the country's permission, we shall provide a thrust forward for the British people in the exciting technological world of today and tomorrow.

3.3 pm

Mr. Neil Kinnock (Islwyn)

I congratulate the hon. Member for Davyhulme (Mr. Churchill) on his speech, when he moved the motion on the Loyal Address in characteristically sparkling style. I also congratulate the hon. Member for Sherwood (Mr. Stewart) on the way in which he performed the difficult task of seconding that motion.

The hon. Member for Davyhulme has had a chequered parliamentary career, on and off the Front Bench and in and out of the executive committee of the 1922 Committee. He is a man of many dare-devil deeds, not the least of which was to be caught speeding at Talybont, Ceredigion, by probably the only policeman on the mid-Wales roads that day—and he was probably on a push bike.

Perhaps the hon. Gentleman's greatest disappointment during all the time since he came to the House on the same day as me back in 1970 was the failure to his Obscene Publications (Protection of Children, etc.) (Amendment) Bill in April last year. All that bloodiness and sweatiness, and it ended in tears after great striving by the hon. Gentleman. Then, after all that, the hon. Gentleman had the galling experience of coming sixth again in last November's ballot for private Members' Bills. Not that the hon. Gentleman knew about it. I read that he had not even put his name into the ballot. Some impish spirit, some parliamentary Puck, had been and gone and done it for him without telling him. I do not know what the Orders are on that or who could get up to such mischief, but all I can say is, "It was not I."

However, I have had other encounters with the hon. Gentleman. One that I recall most clearly was at the Oxford Union about 15 years ago when we debated against each other on industrial relations. A speaker from the floor made the allegation that the hon. Gentleman's grandfather, when Home Secretary, had sent the troops against the striking miners of Tonypandy in 1910. I do not exaggerate when I say that the hon. Member for Davyhulme was incandescent. He was outraged. He leapt to his feet in great heat, and with clarion words stilled the whose house. "That is a lie," said he, and complete silence fell upon the Oxford Union. Clearly, we were witnessing history being made. The hon. Gentleman announced to the hushed house, "My grandfather did not send the troops to Tonypandy. Under his orders, they detrained" — I remember the words well "at Swindon." There was a gasp of awe around the chamber of the Oxford Union. The hon. Gentleman followed that with the unforgettable words, "My grandfather did not send troops. He sent only 100 mounted police and 200 unmounted police." [Laughter.] There was a similar reaction in the Oxford Union. The rest of the story was somewhat lost.

The War Office and the Home Office minutes of the time record that Mr. Churchill and Secretary of State for War Haldane both stopped the troops, and then a few days later Mr. Churchill, as Home Secretay, did send them in — the 18th Hussars. They played football against the strikers. As a matter of interest, the score was 2–1 to the troops. But that is all history. As everyone is probably happier with his own version, it probably means that matters are best left at that. The hon. Member for Davyhulme may recall his grandfather's version of events. I recall my grandfather's version of events. He was on his way to Tonypandy, but unfortunately he was stopped at Pontypridd.

Much has changed in Tonypandy over the intervening years. There are no miners there. They have been wiped out. Much else has changed in Tonypandy in those intervening years —the people there now have their very own viscount.

Mr. Dennis Skinner (Bolsover)

It is Andy Pandy.

Mr. Kinnock

It is always a pleasure to have one of the flower-pot men with me.

When I think of Tonypandy having its very own viscount, I know what upward mobility really means.

The subject of upward mobility brings me to the hon. Member for Sherwood, seconder to the Loyal Address. The hon. Gentleman has a prodigious record of rebellion. He has been a dissident on increased parental contributions to student grants, on Stansted, on fluoridation, on nuclear waste dumping, on the proposed sell-off of BL and on much else. With that record of rebellion, he finds himself today seconding the Loyal Address. I think of his record over the past four years and I look at the hon. Gentleman and say to myself, "This man, with this dexterity and insider knowledge of rebellion, has the makings of a Whip." We shall see about that. We congratulate both hon. Gentlemen on the way in which they moved the motion on the Loyal Address today.

The first Queen's Speech of any Parliament is interesting, not only for the programme that it sets out, but for the people who will be pursuing that programme. Of course, there have been several changes in the Cabinet that has that task in this Parliament. The right hon. Member for Shropshire, North (Mr. Biffen), the former Leader of the House, has been sacked — an act that deprived the Cabinet of its last surviving vertebrate. He has now gone. Others, such as the right hon. Member for Worcester (Mr. Walker), have new jobs. Rumour has it that when the right hon. Gentleman went to No. 10 to speak to the Prime Minister, she said, "I want you to take responsibility for Wales". He said, "But Prime Minister, I have done Agriculture, Fisheries and Food already" — thus betraying the extensive knowledge that he has of the Principality. That appointment proved two things about the Prime Minister. First, contrary to what some of her critics say, she really has a sense of humour. Secondly, it shows that she has total contempt for Wales.

There are, of course, rising stars among the other Cabinet members—people such as the Secretary of State for Social Services, the right hon. Member for Croydon, Central (Mr. Moore), who is your neighbour in Croydon, Mr. Speaker. He has come to be known as an arch privatiser. I remember him— I suspect that you do, too, Mr. Speaker — in an earlier phase of his development when he was a veritable evangelist of Heathism. It is sad to see such a shift of loyalties. Since he is such a decent fellow, perhaps he is most charitably thought of as a good man fallen among ambitions.

The Home Secretary, meanwhile, is charged with a different task. He is apparently on a special detachment, making appeals to the leader of the SDP. I almost feel sorry for the right hon. Member for Plymouth, Devonport (Dr. Owen): Tory seduction to the right of him, democratic fusion to the left of him, and complete confusion everywhere else around him. I am sure that he will find a way out of it. He usually does. That is his habit.

Meanwhile, all those Ministers, together with others, have power in Government. The question is how they will use that power in Government. Will it be used, as the right hon. Member for Shropshire, North recommended, with "circumspection", or will it be used ruthlessly to increase the theft of powers from local democracy? Will it be used contemptuously to ignore the overwhelming votes and indisputable views of the people of Scotland? Will it be used sensitively to unify, or savagely to deprive and to divide? All the signs are that this Government, like the one before it, will use power malevolently — to de-control rents and leave private tenants to the mercies of unscrupulous landlords; to conscript youngsters into training schemes regardless of the utility or suitability of those schemes; to break up the Inner London education authority, and break it up in a way that the Secretary of State himself said only a few years ago, in a distinguished report on the subject, would result in a rump of poorer, deprived boroughs and an increase in administrative costs". That was when the Secretary of State was the soggiest of wets. Now he has given himself completely over to the dessicated tendency in the Tory party. He is prepared to conduct half-baked experiments on our children that he would never inflict on his own children. He will conduct experiments in centralisation and in Government control. He will conduct experiments in so-called open enrolment and opting out, and in budget management by head teachers that has flopped wherever it has been rehearsed. Most of all, the Secretary of State will end free schooling and start charging for what in his prejudice and ignorance he calls "extras".

That is the Government's way — to ensure that education, health care and so many other essentials of opportunity and security, are rationed by charges. They will make the offer of provision to everyone and then say that if one wants it, one will have to pay for it. Today they say, "Pay for field trips, music, sport, cookery and art"—so-called extras in the curriculum; tomorrow they will say, "To Pay for books"— indeed, they are doing it already; and the day after they will say, "Pay for teachers." Any hon. Members who deny that do not even comprehend the proposals that stumbled out from the Prime Minister and the Secretary of State in the course of the election campaign.

This Government know the price of everything and the value of absolutely nothing. Not content with charging for health care or education, they will, with their poll tax, make people pay to vote. That is what the poll tax means. Apart from the fact that millions will be unable to pay the tax or will have immense difficulty in paying it because of their poverty, that there will be extra costs for business in many parts of the country, that there will be a massive increase in bureaucracy and the bills that go with that and that there will be a great increase in centralisation by a Government who always say that they want to roll back the state but always roll on the state over anything that stands in their way, the poll tax will mean that the people of this democracy of Britain will have to pay for their vote. If the poll tax is introduced in England and Wales, it will mean that, as in Scotland, inclusion on a register of voters will mean liability for poll tax. If a citizen registers for the one, he registers for the other. If one votes, one pays. The only way not to pay is to surrender one's right to vote under the poll tax system.

In all of this the Government turn the basic democratic rule of no taxation without representation on its head. With the poll tax, they are saying: no representation without taxation. The vote in the British democracy is to cost an average £205 per adult per year if the Government have their way with the poll tax. The Government know that very well. Their own White Paper in 1984 said that the poll tax can be, seen as a tax on the right to vote". They know what they are doing and still they are going ahead with making the exercise of democratic rights in this country conditional on registration to pay a tax. The Government know it very well. That is only one among the many reasons that have always existed for Governments in this country of every colour and for Governments in so many other democracies rejecting the poll tax.

In the United States, whose tax system the Prime Minister is said to admire very much, the 24th amendment to the constitution lays down that no poll tax should be allowed to deny or abridge the right of citizens to vote". That amendment was resisted by only one group in the whole of the United States during the early 1960s— the clique that controlled the state of Mississippi. Here in 1987, in the state of Missis Thatcher, we have a Government who are insisting on imposing a poll tax and everything that goes with it— abridging the right to vote in a way that is forbidden under the constitution of our sister democracy and should be forbidden by any decent Government in this democratic country.

Even with all that, the Prime Minister still tells us that she wants more power to the people. She cannot want that and a poll tax, for the two are incompatible. Indeed, the Prime Minister does not appear to want a free society as we understand it. She appears to want a fee-paying society. Those who support her, those who support payment for schooling, those who support payment for health care and those who support the decontrolling of rents, the privatisation of water and the conscription of the young unemployed should ask themselves one question: why was every single one of those ideas jettisoned 40, 50, 60 or 70 years ago by Liberal Governments, Labour Governments and by Conservative Governments, too? Indeed, many of the Acts abandoning the brutal and miserable system that this Government wants to reintroduce were instigated by previous Conservative Governments whose memory this Government disgrace.

The reason for the abandonment of private water, the sale of health care, payment for education, rent decontrol and so much else of the trappings of misery was summed up by Winston Churchill. They were abandoned because, they brought the vultures of utter ruin to the dwellings of the nation". A consensus gradually and deliberately grew to get rid of what the present Government want to exhume and restore as the code for living and government in this democracy.

Of course, the Government will claim that their measures, some of which I have just listed, will not bring back the wretchedness or the division of which Winston Churchill spoke in 1945. They will insist that all that they propose are means of modifying and modernising in the name of what they call independence and choice.

But independence for whom? Independence for the tenant who must pay a decontrolled rent? Independence for the youngsters who must accept whatever training they are given, on pain of destitution? [Interruption.] Conservative Members may laugh, but in the 1930s the men of my family had to take exactly the same kind of punishment. They were taken from the north, from south Wales and from Scotland and they were told that unless they went to forced labour in training camps they would lose their dole. Those people, who had their freedom wrenched from them for months of their youth, were expected five years later to fight and win for freedom. That is why I say that the present Government are a disgrace to the past of even their own party. Even their party learnt the lessons of those days.

Mr. Robert Adley (Christchurch)

Walking backwards to Christmas.

Mr. Kinnock

No. The Conservative party is exhuming the dead past. We are trying to keep it in the past; they are trying to make a tomorrow of all those yesterdays.

Are we getting independence for the householder who must buy water from a private monopoly? Are we getting independence for the pensioners and others who will be hit by further cuts in housing benefit? Where is the independence in all that?

Where is the choice? Where is the choice for the parents who are compelled to pay for the schooling of their children or take the risk that their education will be sacrificed? That is not choice; it is forced charges. What about the choice for the children who are told by the Government, "You can go to school for free, but if you want education in that school you will have to see that your parents pay"? What a choice! How can the Government have the gall to say to those children that this is a free country and that we have a free education system but that children's chances in that system and their future opportunities will depend on the ability and willingness of their parents to pay for what the Secretary of State calls the extras? The right hon. Gentleman knows that those "extras" are vital to a decent, modern education.

Where is the choice in a system that requires people to beg or borrow the price of an operation or to wait interminably in pain? Where is the choice for the widow whose entitlement to state earnings-related pension has been cut in half by the Government? Where is the choice in all that? It is obvious that under this Government independence is a mockery and that such choice is a taunt for those who do not have the money to buy education and health care, the opportunity and the essential services, at the time, on the day and in the place that they need them.

In every part of the Government's programme there are counterfeit offers of advance in choice and independence. The Government's inner city proposals are a prime example. They spent years taking over £2 billion in rate support grant away from the poorest areas and the poorest cities in our land. Now they say in the Queen's Speech that they will pay special regard to the needs of those self-same areas. We know that that special regard will not mean the restitution of rate support grant or the funding of housing programmes. It will mean the turning of those areas into colonies of capital-intensive business and prohibitively-priced accommodation. That is what they have been and what they will continue to be. They will be exclusive in the most literal sense of the word, because they will include only those who can meet the prodigious costs and will exclude those who cannot make the down payments or the repayments. They will exclude local democracy and the interests of the surrounding communities.

We can wish the urban development corporations the very best of luck. We can hope that they will be new centres of employment, but, as we do, we know that continually over the past seven years the Government have cut the rate support grant. They have chopped housing support by 60 per cent., reduced industrial development aid and abolished investment allowances. They do not have the desire or the will to commit the means necessary to deal with the corrosion of life in the inner cities and in many other areas of devastation. [Interruption.] I see that the hon. Member for Rochdale (Mr. Smith) is making his annual visit.

It is for all those reasons that the Government inevitably decrease opportunities, increase poverty, multiply division and diminish democracy. They inevitably want to put an entry charge on all the doors of learning and care and opportunity, the doors that people need to pass through if individual freedom is not just to be a fine and noble phrase but a real chance of living.

The Prime Minister marked her election victory a fortnight ago by quoting Rudyard Kipling. She spoke of the need to govern with An humble and a contrite heart. For a definition of the Government's attitude towards the people she would have done better to read wider and to have read, Pass the hat for your credit's sake, and pay-pay-pay! The maxim of modern Conservatism is that if one cannot pay, one should stay away; if one cannot afford the fee, one cannot be really free. That system was buried by history and need and by the decent consensus of all parties decades ago. It will be buried again.

3.29 pm
The Prime Minister (Mrs. Margaret Thatcher)

It is my first and pleasant duty to join the Leader of the Opposition in congratulating my hon. Friends the Members for Davyhulme (Mr. Churchill) and for Sherwood (Mr. Stewart) on the most excellent, witty and stylistic way in which they proposed and seconded the motion on the Loyal Address and the great eloquence and research that they both brought to their task.

My hon. Friend the Member for Davyhulme knows well the problems of bringing modern technological industries into the older industrial areas. He was instrumental in trying to get an urban development corporation for Trafford Park, some of which falls in his constituency, because he wants to bring to that area — [AN HON. MEMBER: "Trafford Park is outside his constituency."] Very well—some of which falls close to his constituency. My hon. Friend wants to bring to that area some of the good work that has already been apparent in the urban development corporation in Docklands and on Merseyside.

My hon. Friend also dealt with Britain's role in the world and the need for strong defence, and for us to be a reliable ally in NATO, which is vital to our defence policy. Less well known is his work for health in the community, because he is—

Mr. Eric S. Heffer (Liverpool, Walton)

Will the right hon. Lady give way?

The Prime Minister

I would like to get on a little.

Mr. Heffer

rose—

Mr. Speaker

Order. I do not think that the Prime Minister is giving way.

The Prime Minister

May I at least finish congratulating my hon. Friends and get on to some of the political content of my speech?

Less well known is my hon. Friend's work for health in the community. He happens to be a pilot and has voluntarily, frequently at very short notice, put himself on duty to fetch pharmaceuticals urgently needed for hospitals and orders for spare-part surgery. We thank him for that work, which is much less well known than it should be.

My hon. Friend follows his family's great tradition in serving this House. I pay tribute to his work today and to all that he has done for us on his own account.

I also congratulate my hon. Friend the Member for Sherwood on his excellent and witty speech, and on his tremendous victory two weeks ago. We remember the firm stand that he took against intimidation and on the right to go to work during the coal strike, and this won him the support of local miners and of the overwhelming majority of people in the country. [Interruption.]

Mr. Speaker

Order. It is very unseemly for hon. Members to shout. If the hon. Member for Liverpool, West Derby (Mr. Wareing) remains silent, he may have a chance later to speak at greater length. He should not intervene from a sedentary position.

The Prime Minister

I listened carefully to what the right hon. Member for Islwyn (Mr. Kinnock) said. He seemed long on words but short on content and I began to understand why he lost the general election in such a decisive way. He seemed to address many of his remarks to some of the shibboleths of the 1930s. Those have no appeal whatsoever to the population of our country, which is becoming home-owning, share-owning, and savings-owning and having an independence it would never otherwise have got. Those class shibboleths have no relevance to our modern society. People know full well that they have a higher standard of living than they have ever had before, stemming from a Government who, in a partnership with the people, have brought about economic strength and a standard of health care and social security that we have never had before.

Mr. Allan Roberts (Bootle)

rose—

The Prime Minister

I will give way now that I am on the political part of my speech.

Mr. Roberts

Will the right hon. Lady explain why house prices are falling dramatically on Merseyside, while rising steeply in London, and why this is especially so in Sefton, the lowest rated metropolitan district in the country, with a 20-year record of Conservative control? Has it anything to do with unemployment?

The Prime Minister

I hope that one day Merseyside will welcome the private sector within Liverpool and thereby confirm the comments of Mr. Kilroy-Silk, who very perceptively said: In fact, the Militants and their ilk in Liverpool are the biggest deterrents to job creation on Merseyside that there have ever been.

Mr. Heffer

The right hon. Lady will know that I happened to meet her at lunch time today at a certain reception. I asked her whether she would come to Liverpool and see for herself what the local authority in that area has done, to see the houses and sports centres that have been built and all the work that is necessary. I asked whether she would then perhaps change her mind about what local authorities under Labour control have been doing for the people in areas such as Liverpool.

The Prime Minister

I was not aware that we were able to refer to such matters in this debate. As the hon. Gentleman knows, I shall be visiting a number of inner city areas. However, I was referring to the comments made by Mr. Kilroy-Silk about what had brought Liverpool low.

Mr. Heffer

Mr. Kilroy-Silk is a past figure.

The Prime Minister

I hope that the hon. Member for Liverpool, Walton (Mr. Heffer) will give me the chance to finish the quotation. Mr. Kilroy-Silk said: Dozens of times in the last few years I have tried fruitlessly to persuade companies that I knew were looking for sites for new plants to locate on Merseyside and in Knowsley, but each time the decision went against us, because of their perception of our Militancy. If we want more jobs on Merseyside, Labour-controlled local authorities will have to welcome private enterprise within their borders.

At the heart of the Gracious Speech is the section referring to the economy, and at the heart of Britain's economic strength are the continuing policies of sound financial management. They are designed to reduce inflation further, to keep firm control of public expenditure, and to increase enterprise and employment by incentives and training. It takes time to establish a reputation for prudent economic policies of the kind enjoyed by Germany and Switzerland, with all the benefits that they bring, but Britain is now succeeding. Control of inflation through sound financial policies is and will remain our top priority.

It has been the habit in the past two terms of office and will be the same habit in the next for the Government to set the financial and legal framework. However, the wealth of a country is the effort of its people and the way in which they respond to that framework. They have responded and that has brought a very high standard of living. However, effort depends upon incentives. That is frequently forgotten by those who make easy election promises, but, as the result of the last election showed, people were not taken in by those promises in any way.

Mr. Dennis Canavan (Falkirk, West)

Will the Prime Minister give way?

The Prime Minister

The fundamental wisdom of the truths that I have enunciated was acknowledged then. Our policies have brought record living standards and better standards of health and social services. The news since the Dissolution has confirmed the sense and soundness of our policies.

Mr. Canavan

Give way.

The Prime Minister

No, I will not give way while I am referring to this section of the Gracious Speech.

The news since the Dissolution is good news, and of course Opposition Members do not want to hear such news. There have been good balance of payments figures. Inflation is at 4 per cent.—still too high, but far less than the 7 per cent. that the Labour party says that it would be happy to start with. There is continuing growth in industrial production and national income. There have been encouraging business surveys from the Confederation of British Industry and the chambers of commerce. There are lower mortgage rates and lower gas prices, and record British Telecom profits are helping to finance a record £2 billion investment programme. In addition, the OECD forecasts that Britain this year will have the fastest growth of all the major industrial countries. That is all of the good news since the election.

Mr. Canavan

rose—

The Prime Minister

Yes, I shall give way to the hon. Gentleman, who comes from Scotland, which, after London and the south-east, has the second highest income per head of any part of the United Kingdom.

Mr. Canavan

A couple of minutes ago the Prime Minister mentioned her general election success, but her party in Scotland has been reduced to such a discredited rump that Scottish Tory Members of Parliament could not even form a football team and the Secretary of State for Scotland is like some discredited colonial governor-general who received no democratic mandate from the people whom he governs. Why is there no mention of that in the Queen's Speech? Why, in particular, is there no mention of proposals to do what the majority of people of Scotland want—the setting-up of a devolved Scottish Parliament with legislative and economic powers to help repair a lot of the damage that has been done by eight hard years of Thatcherism?

The Prime Minister

I seem to remember that the hon. Gentleman made a similar interruption in 1983. I seem to remember that I gave him a reply similar to the reply that I am going to give now.

In three out of the last five Labour Governments Conservatives had more seats in England than Labour, and we had to endure it. What is the hon. Gentleman proposing — separatism? May I point out what the Leader of the Opposition said in the House on the devolution Bill in 1977? He said: At this point I could pause for cheers from the SNP and Plaid Cymru … They know, and they must acknowledge, that their proposterous ideas of economic self-dependence, in any degree of economic separation and the consequences that go with it, would mean utter misery for the people of both Scotland and Wales." —[Official Report, 15 November 1977; Vol. 939, c. 469.] Now, let me tell the hon. Member for Falkirk, West (Mr. Canavan) that I have left the best good news until last. But before I come to that I should say that, in spite of our good news, we must be alert to the risks to the international economy, discussed at the Venice summit. The agreements reached there on the need for surplus and deficit countries to take action to correct their imbalances will need to be translated into action.

But the best news is the continuing fall in unemployment, confirmed by last month's figures, the largest monthly fall ever. Other than in Northern Ireland, unemployment has fallen in the last year throughout the country, fastest in Wales, the north-west, the west midlands and the north. Sustained economic growth is now creating enough jobs to reduce the number of people unemployed, even though the population of working age is increasing.

Nevertheless—

Mr. Robert N. Wareing (Liverpool, West Derby)

rose—

The Prime Minister

No, I shall carry on a little longer, otherwise I shall be speaking for too long and I do not wish to do that.

Nevertheless, Government special schemes—

Mr. Wareing

rose—

The Prime Minister

I am on the particular point that sustained economic growth is now creating enough jobs to reduce the number of people unemployed even though the population of working age is increasing. I give way on that particular point.

Mr. Wareing

I am very interested and pleased when there is any real reduction in unemployment, but can the Prime Minister tell the House when the unemployment figure will be down to what it was on 3 May 1979?

The Prime Minister

As the hon. Gentleman is aware, when we came into power in 1979 the hidden unemployment, the restrictive practices and the failure of the then Labour Government to deal with such things left us with a problem. Perhaps he will read the passage in Lord Donoughue's book about that. He said: Labour's problem was that its general commitment to industrial investment and maintaining full employment, as well as its close ties with the trade unions, made it politically difficult to cut out the bad parts of British industry, even though it was essential for its long-term efficiency and survival. Unless we had done that there would have been far more unemployment than there is now and British industry is now efficient and doing very well. That is an interesting book and I may have time to quote rather more from it during what I have to say.

Nevertheless, Government special schemes will continue to play a very important part. There will be guaranteed places—[Interruption.]

Mr. Speaker

Order. The Leader of the Opposition had a fair hearing; so should the Prime Minister.

The Prime Minister

There will be guaranteed places on the youth training scheme, which is an excellent scheme, for school leavers under the age of 18 who do not go into employment or further education.

Legislation will be introduced to enable benefit to be withheld from young people who deliberately choose to remain unemployed, and quite rightly so.

Moreover, we believe that jobcentres should be transferred from the Manpower Services Commission to the Department of Employment so that they can work more closely with unemployment benefit offices to provide a more effective service of help. We shall consult the Manpower Services Commission accordingly.

Job opportunities are growing steadily — 1,100,000 more since March 1983. Our task is to help to ensure that those who are seeking work have the right training to fill those opportunities and the help to start a business on their own if they so wish.

I refer now to something that I referred to in reply to the Leader of the Opposition. The spreading ownership of housing, shares, pensions and savings has been one of the great achievements of the past eight years. That is one reason—the bringing of independence and power to the people—why the right hon. Gentleman's party did so badly in the election. People do not want the songs and policies of collectivism. They want the capacity, ability and opportunity to own their own houses, shares, pensions and many other matters besides.

The Labour party favours what it now calls social ownership, which is nationalisation in sheep's clothing. The effect, would be to concentrate power in Whitehall and to deprive millions of ordinary people of their shareholding in industry. By contrast, we shall continue our programme of privatisation, thus freeing businesses to respond to the needs of the customer and increasing the opportunities for share ownership.

Now we have a new task. Just as we took power from trade union bosses and restored it to their members, so we must now extend to the people new freedoms and responsibilities in housing, education and local authority finance. These will be the subject of three major Bills that have been signalled in the Gracious Speech. It is our purpose to bring new opportunities into the inner cities in particular and to make town halls more accountable, for nowhere are the damaging effects of dependence and socialism seen more clearly than in some of our inner cities.

We shall abolish the domestic rates—a grossly unfair tax—and replace them with a community charge.

Mr. John Maxton (Glasgow, Cathcart)

rose—

The Prime Minister

Subject to proper protection for those in need, it is right that we should all pay something towards the cost of the local services from which we all benefit. The new unified business rate will protect businesses and jobs in inner cities from the councils which obstruct wealth and job creation by imposing very high rates.

Mr. Maxton

rose—

Mr. John Home Robertson (East Lothian)

rose—

The Prime Minister

As the House knows, in spite of those high rates, some Labour-controlled local authorities have plunged recklessly into debt. I take this opportunity to make it clear once again that the Government have never stood behind the debts of local authorities and will not do so now.

We have made great strides towards a property-owning democracy. Some 1,000,000 council houses have been sold since 1979, and two-thirds of our people now own their own homes.

Mr. Maxton

rose—

Mr. Speaker

The hon. Members for Glasgow, Cathcart (Mr. Maxton) and for East Lothian (Mr. Home Robertson) know that the Prime Minister is not giving way. They must not persist.

The Prime Minister

We will ensure that home ownership continues to spread by maintaining mortgage tax relief and the tenants' right to buy.

If one wishes to examine the Labour Government's attitude to housing and how they resisted any attempt to bring increased freedom to people to purchase their houses or to increase freedom in other ways, one has only to look at Lord Donoughue's account of the Labour Government's years in power. On page 104 of his book he says: Labour's housing policy was dominated by dogma and the vested interests of a minority of activists whose power was based on the local authority building departments and who were out of touch with and apparently completely unconcerned with the wishes of British families.

Mr. D. N. Campbell-Savours (Workington)

Will the right hon. Lady give way?

The Prime Minister

No. I have given way a great deal and I must get on.

Our new task must be to extend the benefits of greater choice and independence to those in rented accommodation. Rent controls have reduced the private sector to a mere 8 per cent. of the housing market, with the result that there is almost a municipal monopoly in rented housing. Too many tenants are confined to large monolithic and sometimes badly kept council estates. It is high time for town hall monopoly to be replaced by individual choice in renting. We shall therefore introduce major housing reforms in this Session.

First, we shall give council tenants—where they are dissatisfied with their landlords—the right to transfer to other approved landlords, such as tenant co-operatives and housing associations. Secondly, urban development corporations have been successful in restoring derelict industrial areas, and we believe that a similar approach could be adopted for housing in some places. We will therefore take powers to create housing action trusts—initially on a pilot basis—to take over and renovate areas of council housing in especially bad repair.

But wider choice in housing also requires a revival of the private rented sector. For new lettings—I repeat, new lettings—we will therefore bring forward a series of proposals to reduce rent controls which have so greatly restricted the supply of homes for rent. Half a million private sector properties now lie empty, and our proposals will help to bring those back on to the market.

Mr. Skinner

rose—

The Prime Minister

In all these measures existing tenants will keep their present protection in respect of rents and security of tenure, and we will strengthen the law against harassment. All these policies have been set out in the most detailed manifesto ever placed before the British people. That manifesto said what we would do, unlike the Labour party's manifesto, which tried to conceal what it would do.

A home should be a source of pride to the family living in it, regardless of whether it is owned or rented. Greater choice and independence will help to make it so. I again contrast our whole policy on housing — which has brought more ownership, opportunity and choice to people — with the policy of the Labour party. Lord Donoughue also said: The left wing of the Labour party began to mobilise hostility to what they saw as a threat to their local authority power bases. Although they themselves personally often enjoyed the pleasures and benefits of living in their own private Hampstead homes, they were dogmatically committed to denying those pleasures and benefits to council tenants." We have given them to those tenants and will continue to do so.

Mr. Skinner

rose—

The Prime Minister

No.

The reform of education is the third of the fundamental reforms to be introduced this Session. Although in many of our local authorities children are receiving an excellent education, in others there is widespread dissatisfaction. In too many schools education does not match either what the parents want or what the children need. In this first Session of the new Parliament we shall bring forward a major Bill which will introduce a national curriculum with clear attainment targets and tests during the period of compulsory schooling; which will prevent local education authorities from putting artificial limits on numbers, so making it possible for popular schools to take in more pupils; which will enable maintained schools to opt out of local authority control where parents and governing bodies so wish and to be funded directly from the Department of Education and Science. The right hon. Member for Islwyn knew that when he made his mischievous statement from the Dispatch Box. He knows that no fees will be payable to those schools that opt out.

The Bill will allow London boroughs to pull out of ILEA and to run their own education service, and it will give many head teachers and governing bodies within local authorities control over the budgets of their schools. Where some of the local authorities have started this they have met with great success and far better use of money.

Mr. Kinnock

When the Prime Minister says that there will be no fees, is she saying that there will be no requirement that can be enforced by a local education authority or any school in the maintained sector that makes the provision of music, art, field trips that are essential for the curriculum, sport or any other subject on the recognised curriculum dependent upon parental contribution or the payment of any fee?

The Prime Minister

Those schools will be on the same financial basis as local education authority schools. Their fees—[Hon. Members "Ah."] I mean their finances. There will be no fees—[Interruption.]

Mr. Speaker

Order.

Hon. Members

Fees.

The Prime Minister

They will be on the same financial basis as the schools under local education authority control. Their finances will come not from the local education authority but from the Department of Education and Science. There will be no fees payable by the parents. The right hon. Member for Islwyn is referring to cases that have come up from the ombudsman and are before the courts as to whether charges at schools in local education authorities are permissible for extras such as holidays overseas and music. That is a case which is now being dealt with. The schools that opt out will be on a similar basis to those of local education authorities, but their finances will come not from the local education authority but from the Department of Education and Science.

Mr. Campbell-Savours

Fees.

The Prime Minister

It is no good the hon. Gentleman mouthing the word "fees". There will be no fees payable.

Mr. Kinnock

Can the Prime Minister tell us whether she will ensure that the legisation required to permit schools to opt out will prohibit the charging of fees as a condition of entry? Can what she describes as "extras" be made subject to charges? I am familiar with the Hereford case and other cases in which the courts have held that it is illegal to charge for those subjects recognised to be part of the curriculum. Is the right hon. Lady proposing that that law should be changed so that schools can charge fees for what she loosely describes as "extras"?

The Prime Minister

Those cases have gone to the ombudsman and are now going through the courts. My right hon. Friend the Secretary of State for Education and Science issued a statement about that yesterday and is consulting upon the result of those cases. The right hon. Gentleman will have masses of opportunities to discuss this matter when the Bill comes before the House. It will be a very considerable Bill.

Parents want schools that will provide their children with the knowledge, training and character—

Several Hon. Members

rose—

Mr. Speaker

Order. Unless the Prime Minister gives way, right hon. and hon. Gentlemen must resume their seats.

Mr. Andrew Faulds (Warley, East)

On a point of order, Mr. Speaker.

Mr. Speaker

I will hear it.

Mr. Faulds

I am grateful, Sir. It is the first point of order of the new Parliament, and it is a very good and genuine one. Will you ensure, Sir, that tomorrow, when Hansard is scrutinised, it contains an exact report of what the Prime Minister has actually said this afternoon?

Mr. Speaker

Hansard always does that.

The Prime Minister

I shall be grateful because it will make it clear that no fees will be payable for schools.

Dr. David Owen (Plymouth, Devonport)

rose—

The Prime Minister

I shall give way to the right hon. Gentleman when I have finished this paragraph.

Parents want schools that will provide their children with the knowledge, training and character to fit them for today's world. They want them to be taught basic educational skills.

We shall enlarge the right of parents to choose those schools that will best meet the needs of their children. The legislation sets out to achieve the most far-reaching reform of education since the Education Act 1944.