HC Deb 29 June 1928 vol 219 cc866-79

If a local authority are of opinion that by reason of the lateness of the hour at which daily newspapers are received in their area or in any part thereof there is not reasonably sufficient time for sale of such newspapers in shops before the general closing hours fixed by this Act they may by order substitute for the said general closing hours such later hours, as they think fit, as respects the sale of daily newspapers in shops in their area or in that part thereof, but a local authority shall not make an order under this section unless they are satisfied that such an order is desired by the occupiers of at last two-thirds in number of the shops to be thereby affected.—[Mr. Womersley.]

Brought up, and read the First time.


I beg to move, "That the Clause be read a Second time."

In explaining this proposed new Clause I must refer to the First Schedule of the Bill, "Transactions not prevented by this Act or by Closing Orders made under the Principal Act." I must also ask hon. Members to refer to paragraph "g" of the First Schedule, which reads: newspapers, periodicals and books from the book-stalls of such terminal and main-line stations as may be approved by the Secretary of State. That gives the Secretary of State power to approve the sale of newspapers at railway bookstalls after the ordinary shop closing hours, where he is satisfied that they cannot receive the evening newspapers in time for sale before the closing hour. I am moving this new Clause on behalf of a large body of small traders belonging to the Newsagents' Association, who feel that if this permission is to be given by the Secretary of State in respect of certain railway bookstalls it ought to be possible for the same privilege to be accorded to the small newsagent who has to earn his living in the same district in which the railway terminus is situated. It is necessary that these men should have some opportunity of trading in this way, because there are certain remote parts of the country where it is absolutely impossible to get the late edition of the evening newspaper from the town where it is printed to those districts before the closing hour of 8 o'clock.

I might quote my own county of Lincoln. The last edition of the newspaper printed at Lincoln cannot reach the town of Louth before 8.15. [AN HON. MEMBER: "That is an evening newspaper." The new Clause says "daily."] The term "daily" does not necessarily apply to a morning newspaper; it has to be put in the Clause in that form in order to pass the eye of the examiner of Amendments to Bills. In my own town of Grimsby we have a very highly influential and spleen- did newspaper published in the evening—a newspaper of which I am very proud, which circulates in the remote districts of North and mid-Lincolnshire—but it is impossible for the late edition of that newspaper to reach those who sell it in the outlying districts in time for sale before the hours of closing. Take the East Riding of Yorkshire and the important city of Hull. It is impossible to get the latest edition of the Hull evening newspaper, also a very important evening newspaper, in the town of Bridlington before 8.12 p.m. All that I am asking is that the local authorities shall be given power to take these circumstances into consideration and if they feel satisfied that there is a two-thirds majority of those engaged in the business who desire that they shall be allowed to keep open a little later in order that they can sell these evening newspapers, and thereby compete on equal terms with the railway bookstalls, they would be able to put the Clause into operation. It is only fair to the small traders that this should be done. It is only putting them on a line with the big bookstall firms, and I ask the House to agree to the new Clause.


I beg to second the Motion. It is not so much a question of the terminal and main line station bookstalls. My experience is that in the large towns the sale of evening newspapers has practically finished by 7.30 p.m. Very few evening newspapers have any editions which go to press after 6.30 p.m. or 7 p.m., but it is the outlying country districts where there are no main line stations and there is not a big town, for which we desire to cater by this new Clause. Unless something of this sort is provided, many of these country districts will be left without late editions of the evening newspapers. That would be a hardship. I hope that the new Clause will be accepted.


I hope the Home Secretary will take the same course with regard to this new Clause that he did in regard to the other. Let me give a few reasons why the House ought to reject this new Clause. If hon. Members will turn to the Report of the Departmental Committee which inquired into the subject they will find this sentence in regard to newspapers: We have carefully considered all the evidence presented to us…and we recom- mend that the sale of newspapers in shops should be subject to the general public closing provisions but that their sale in any place not being a shop should be exempted. That is in the Report of the Departmental Committee which received evidence in regard to the point raised by the hon. Member for Grimsby (Mr. Womersley). The hon. Member is endeavouring to take advantage of one concession already granted in the Bill. The trouble in regard to concessions is that everybody else is jealous of the concession already granted. The concession that has already been granted relates to station bookstalls, and because station bookstalls are to be authorised by the right hon. Gentleman to sell newspapers after the closing hour these small retail newsagents come along and say, "The bookstall at the station is in competition with us." If we proceed on these lines we shall never end the concessions and we should be back again where we were prior to the War. The local authority, under this Clause, would be able to decide, not simply on the question of competition between a station bookstall and the retail newsagents, but a majority of two-thirds of the retail newsagents could convince the local authority, whether there exists a station bookstall or not in the place, that this concession should be granted. A local authority under this new Clause, irrespective of the station bookstall, would have the right to declare any hour for the sale of newspapers. The hon. Member for Grimsby mentioned the case of evening newspapers. If he will further analyse the effect of his proposal he will understand that the situation would be impossible. There are newspapers published at six o'clock in the evening, and if you are going to give retail newsagents the right to open in all parts of the country until the six o'clock edition of the London newspapers reach their destination they will have to keep open until midnight. The evening editions of the London newspapers do not reach Manchester until ten o'clock—and Manchester people do not want London evening newspapers at all. The Clause is absolutely impossible. If we make one concession after another the Bill will be absolutely a farce. I hope the Home Secretary will not accept the proposal.


Let me deal with the last point made by the hon. Member for Westhoughton (Mr. Rhys Davies) with regard to evening newspapers which he said would not reach their destination until midnight. In that case you would not get a majority of two-thirds of the local newsagents asking to be allowed to keep open for the sale of newspapers until midnight. I do not think that is a very potent argument. I quite agree that the question of the sale of newspapers is a very difficult point. A body representing the vast majority of newsagents in this country came before the Committee and asked that they should be deprived of the privilege they had under the Act of 1920 of selling newspapers up to any hour. I look sometimes with a little suspicion on bodies who say they represent all the traders in a particular trade, but in this case it was evident that these people did represent the views of the vast majority and not merely a few influential concerns. I was present last year at the annual dinner of the Newsagents' Society, and I could see that there was a very strong feeling in favour of closing at eight o'clock.

I am a little surprised that the hon. Member for Grimsby (Mr. Womersley) should bring forward this new Clause. I am certain he has not done so without making careful inquiries and finding out that there are a number of newsagents who want this concession. If there are in some country districts a number of newsagents who desire to sell newspapers arriving after eight o'clock there can be no harm in that if the newsagents themselves express a desire to be able to do so. It is undoubtedly the fact that you cannot get an evening paper at all, especially what is called the "Late Special," in country places until after eight o'clock, and if shopkeepers, by a clear majority, say that they can do a little bit of business by selling these newspapers after eight o'clock I cannot see why this House should deprive them of the opportunity. Therefore, on balance I do not think we should be vitiating or detracting from the Report of the Committee if we pass this new Clause, which only gives power to shops to open after eight o'clock after a two-thirds majority of the people concerned have expressed a desire to do so.


I must cross swords at once with the hon. Member for West- houghton (Mr. Rhys Davies) when he says that London newspapers are not wanted in Manchester, whether they are morning or evening newspapers. I can assure him that there is a great demand for London newspapers, morning and evening, all over the country, and even in Scotland. I rise not to support the Amendment, but to oppose it. Although I should like to see every reasonable facility given to newspapers of the country for sale I do not think the hon. Member has made out his case. One would suppose that he would have given some evidence that newspaper proprietors were unable to reach these country districts at an earlier hour. It is quite easy for any newspaper proprietor, if he finds that the newsagent in a particular district of the country is not able to secure his copies of the newspaper before the hour of closing, to arrange for the paper to be printed and issued at such a time as will enable it to be on sale in this particular district within the reasonable hours provided by the present legislation.

The House will be making a mistake if it accepts this Amendment. I do not think readers of evening papers are so interested in the latest editions that they want to sit up late at night in order to read it. They are content to wait until the morning to find out what has taken place in the afternoon of the day before, and it would not be fair to introduce a new Clause like this, which will have the effect of enabling these newsagents in every town, irrespective of the difficulty of obtaining newspapers before the hour of closing, to get a plebiscite of the newsagents in the locality merely for the purpose of securing the right of selling newspapers after the hour of closing. It is quite easy in some of these remote country districts to arrange for the sale of newspapers outside the shops. There are no restrictions in that case. If there is any real demand for newspapers the man in the street would undoubtedly sell them. No case has been made out for this rather drastic exception in the Bill, and I trust the House will be very careful before it accepts the proposal.


When this matter was considered by the Committee a very careful balance was taken between concessions on the one hand and permissions on the other, and I hope we shall not enlarge on the recommendations of the Committee in the direction desired, because I feel that demands are going to be made in other directions. This question of newspapers was really very carefully considered, and the feeling of the Committee was that it was extremely undesirable that shops should have any opportunity of opening later and that if newspapers had to be sold after closing hours that they should be permitted to be sold in the streets. The House should be very careful before it makes this concession. It may be a small one, but it is only opening the door to further pressure which may come from rather more influential sources.


This new Clause provides considerable food for thought In the first place, I think the House should realise that the Bill does alter the general law. At the present time newspapers are exempt from the law with regard to the closing of shops. I have read the new Clause very carefully, and as far as I can see it is of a very mild character. First of all the local authority has to decide, before any newspaper shop can remain open, that by reason of the lateness of the hour at which daily newspapers are received in an area, there is not sufficient time for the sale of such newspaper. I doubt very much whether there will be any areas where they cannot get the "Daily Herald" in time to have it sold before 8 o'clock at night. I do not know whether my hon. Friend who moved the new Clause moved it in the interests of the "Daily Herald" or not. I want to be equally fair to all newspapers. At all events, that is the first fence that anyone has to get over before getting this exemption.


The hon. Member expressly said that the word "daily" in this case included evening newspapers. That is the danger of it.


I suppose it does mean a newspaper published in the day time, from early morn to dewy eve, even the "Daily Herald" if it should publish an evening addition, which God forbid! The second fence which has to be got over is that the local authority cannot make this order unless satisfied that two-thirds of the shop- keepers who would be affected are in favour of it. I think that the House, before coming to a decision, should see the smallness of the points that are included in this new Clause. AS far as I and the Government are concerned, this is pre-eminently a matter which might be left to the decision of the House. There are certain points in the Bill in regard to which the Government must express definite opinions from time to time, for I want so to guide and control the House that, when the Bill passes, it is a workable Measure that will inure to the advantage of the shopkeeping and shop assistant class. Having pointed out the very small points affected by the new Clause, I suggest that the House should come to a decision as soon as possible and get on to more important points.


One is very much surprised at the attitude of the Home Secretary. I should have thought, judging by the practice of Ministers of the Crown in the present Parliament, that he would have been much more concerned to defend the decision arrived at by the Departmental Committee which he appointed. In the last three years we have had under consideration many matters which have resulted from the recommendations of Departmental Committees, and I cannot recall a single case in which the Minister has adopted quite the attitude that the Home Secretary has adopted this morning. I am not saying that he is not entitled to adopt it. His reference to the "Daily Herald" really had nothing to do with this Clause.


I quite agree.


But we welcome the very great tribute which has been paid by the Home Secretary to the efficacy of the "Daily Herald" from a particular point of view, for he said, "God forbid that there should ever be an evening addition of the Labour paper."


I was thinking of sporting news.

12 n.


I am not a sporting man myself, I do not follow the course of the racehorses. But I have never heard yet that the sporting news of the "Daily Herald" is any Jess reliable than that of journals in which the Home Secretary achieves such popularity and publicity. It is quite evident that the Home Secretary is anxious that there should not be an evening edition of a Labour newspaper, and for obvious reasons. I am also surprised that the hon. Member for Yarmouth (Sir F. Meyer) should have adopted the attitude that he did, because he did a great deal of work on the Committee and signed a report which in my judgment was against the adoption of a new Clause of this kind. The passing of this Clause would lead to very great difficulty in each locality where a local authority could be persuaded by the trade to adopt a by-law as defined in the Clause. If you have a shop open to very late hours for the purposes of the Clause, you will very much increase the difficulties of the local authority in regard to inspection and supervision.

Newsagents deal in a very large number of commodities and if the shop is to be kept open for the sale of newspapers, it is certain that there will be a demand from the unthinking public, when they enter the shop, for other commodities which are stocked not only by the newsagents but also by large numbers of other traders who do not sell newspapers and have perforce to adopt an earlier closing hour. Moreover, many of these other shopkeepers are very often in a large way of business. They have very good trade union conditions and are anxious not to get behind those conditions. On the other hand a very large number of newsagents are not adopting trade union conditions. If the Home Secretary allows this Clause to go forward, he will increase rather than decrease the trouble of distributive labour. We pass Act after Act which increases the duties and responsibilities of local authorities. We cannot possibly make this Clause work fairly as between all the other classes of tradesmen affected by the commodities which are stocked in newagents' shops, unless the local authority increases its inspectorial staff and takes steps to ensure that nothing but newspapers is sold during the extension hours. That is not a position in which this House should allow a Bill to pass.

The Clause would confer a special favour upon a body of retail traders who are already specially favoured. The Home Secretary does not seem to remember that the newsagents have created almost a monopoly in that type of busi- ness. I expect that he is aware, because of his legal qualifications and great experience, that a case has been tried in the Courts between the newsagents and the proprietor of certain newspapers, to the effect that they are entitled to restrain the newspaper proprietor from supplying newspapers or periodicals for sale by anyone of whom the newsagents do not approve. No newsagent can open a shop in that particular district now, except with the permission of this body. They are therefore, actually setting up a monopoly in regard to this class of business.


Is the hon. Member aware that it is not a wealthy body but is composed of men of very small means and is a registered trade union, No. 1770?


That does not alter what I am saying. I am dealing with a legal decision which has been recorded as a result of an action taken by the newsagents, which action confers a monopoly upon them with regard to the supply of newspapers and periodicals. Are we going to ask the House to confer a still further favour on these people on top of the monopoly which they have secured by an injunction in the Courts? I believe such a course would be foreign to the desires of Members of the House. I regard this Clause as reactionary and unworkable and I hope the House will decline to assent to it.

Lieut.-Colonel HENEAGE

I do not think that the opponents of this Measure have been quite fair to the country districts. The hon. Member for Westhoughton (Mr. Rhys Davies) and another hon. Member suggested the possibility of distributing these papers in country areas by getting out earlier editions, but, if they look at the map, they will see that in some places there are very few railways, and in such districts it would be almost impossible to have the newspapers distributed at a reasonable hour even with earlier editions. Other hon. Members have spoken as though it were possible to obtain the newspapers from railway bookstalls, but in some parts of the country railway bookstalls are 40 miles or more apart, and therefore, as a means of distribution, they must be ruled out. I hope the opponents of the Measure will think of the country districts and not only of the towns, and I hope that the proposed new Clause will be accepted.


We on this side are very much concerned that this Measure should have some sort of stability and consistency. We do not want to see a Measure of a sieve-like character, and that is the principal reason why we oppose the proposed New Clause. We are further opposed to it on the ground that it would confer upon a certain body of tradesmen privileges for which they are not asking, and I do not think the House ought to go out of its way to do that. A considerable amount of nonsense has been talked about the benefit to the public in this matter. I fail to see the difference in relation to public advantage, between the sale of newspapers and the sale of any other kind of commodity. It is a question of supplying the needs of the public.


Would the hon. Member say that about the "Social Democrat," to which I am a regular subscriber?


Indeed I would. People who take the "Social Democrat" are sensible enough not to sit up half the night in order to read it.


It is the finest cure for insomnia that I have ever had.


I am pleased to know, at any rate, that the hon. Gentleman does read the "Social Democrat." The point is that this Bill must not be allowed to become merely a sieve through which all kinds of exceptions can pass. When I was abroad during the War, I got my favourite daily newspaper regularly, but always a week late. That made no difference to me. The papers came day by day in exactly the same order as they would come to me at home, and the difference of seven days in the time was never considered by me. I had the same advantage and the same pleasure in reading the papers. Surely the people who are far away from the towns can very easily and reasonably wait until the following morning for the day's news. If we are asked to incorporate this proposal in the Measure on the ground that newsagents have arrived at a certain decision by a majority, then I suggest that it would be desirable also to take the views of the shop assistants and to poll them on the question. I speak with some feeling, because I had 11 years' experience of shop life. I worked 15 hours a day, and I think 12 hours a day is quite long enough for a shop to be open. It is said that news is to be regarded as a kind of public entertainment—something like the supply of intoxicating liquor or cinemas or theatres. In that case the argument should not be for closing the shops at any particular time, but for limiting the hours of assistants in shops and everywhere else. Let us be consistent, however, and, if we are going to deal with this question from the standpoint of the hours at which the shop should be open, then I see no reason for making an exception of the kind proposed in the new Clause.


I would like to pay my tribute to the "Daily Herald" because I am told by my sporting friends that its sporting news is excellent and I gather that the same remark applies to its Stock Exchange tips. I must say that on this point I agree with hon. Members opposite. I have lived in country districts and it is quite true that the people in country districts are very anxious to get the news of the day. As against that circumstance we have to place the convenience of the people who work in shops. Some years ago there would have been a good deal to be said for this New Clause, but, today, practically every country cottage has its wireless installation and the news can be got in that way. It is possibly true that it is not as interestingly or as well dished up as it would be in the evening papers, but, while the news is available, there is not any hardship to the public if the papers are not available in the remoter country districts. I think it would be a dangerous thing if we passed this New Clause.


This class of legislation illustrates the difficulty of dealing with these subjects fairly. The hon. Member for Hillsborough (Mr. A. V. Alexander) objects to the New Clause on the ground that it works an injustice and involves the employment of additional officials by local authorities in order to see that a shopkeeper does not sell commodities other than newspapers. On the other hand, if the Bill were to pass without this New Clause it would work injustice as between district and district. In my own division, there is one town, Aberystwyth, where the evening newspapers come in at 8.15 p.m. That means that no evening newspaper can be sold there, except with the leave of the Home Secretary. They may be hawked about the streets but no shopkeeper could sell them, whereas those papers can be sold in shops in other towns. That illustrates the difficulty of legislating in regard to shop hours, on the basis of closing the shops at a certain fixed hour. It would be much better if it were possible to legislate so as to secure certain hours of work for the shop assistants. That is the proper basis. I have never yet been able to understand why we should tell a man that he must close his own shop at a certain specified hour, even if he is prepared to work longer. I have never understood that point of view. If a man is prepared to keep his shop open, why should he be compelled to shut it simply because other people object to working? The only solution that I can see to that proposition is that we should limit the number of hours that the shop assistants should work, but in its present form I think the Bill would be inequitable as between districts. Therefore, I shall support the Clause now before the House.


May I ask the House to come to a decision? We are getting near closing time, and we have hardly begun to deal with the Bill. I have offered to leave this Clause to the decision of the House, and I hope a Division will now be taken.


I would draw the attention of the House to the fact that all the evidence given to us by the newsagents was in favour of maintaining 8 o'clock closing. They resented the idea of any extension, and anyone who turns up the evidence will agree that it was all in favour of 8 o'clock closing. Everyone declared that it had not produced any difficulty, and now by this Clause it is proposed to undo all that.

Question put, "That the Clause be read a Second time."

The House divided: Ayes, 70; Noes, 99.

Division No. 219.] AYES. [12.19 p.m.
Acland-Troyte, Lieut.-Colonel Gretton, Colonel Rt. Hon. John Philipson, Mabel
Ainsworth, Lieut.-Col. Charles Grotrian, H. Brent Sandeman, N. Stewart
Applin, Colonel R. V. K. Hamilton, Sir R. (Orkney & Shetland) Smith-Carington, Neville W.
Barclay-Harvey, C. M. Hanbury, C. Smithers, Waldron
Beamish, Rear-Admiral T. P. H. Harvey, Major S. E. (Devon, Totnes) Somerville, A. A. (Windsor)
Bird, sir R. B. (Wolverhampton, W.) Henderson, Capt. R. R. (Oxf'd, Henley) Sprot, Sir Alexander
Bowyer, Captain G. E. W. Henderson, Lieut.-Col. Sir Vivian Stuart, Hon. J. (Moray and Nairn)
Brittain, Sir-Harry Heneage, Lieut.-Colonel Arthur P. Sugden, Sir Wilfrid
Brooke, Brigadier-General C. R. I. Hennessy, Major Sir G. R. J. Templeton, W. P.
Cayzer, Maj. Sir Herbt. R. (Prtsmth, S.) Hope, Capt. A. O. J. (Warw'k, Nun.) Tomlinson, R. P.
Cazalet, Captain Victor A. Hore-Belisha, Leslie Vaughan, Morgan, Col. K. P.
Chadwick, Sir Robert Burton Hurd, Percy A. Wallace, Captain D. E.
Cochrane, Commander Hon. A. D. Hutchison, Sir G. A. Clark Ward, Lt.-Col. A. L. (Kingston-on-Hull)
Cope, Major Sir William Hutchison, Sir Robert (Montrose) Warner, Brigadier General W. W.
Crooke, J. Smedley (Deritend) Iveagh, Countess of Warrender, Sir Victor
Davies, Dr. Vernon Lamb, J. Q. Watts, Sir Thomas
Dean, Arthur Wellesley Locker-Lampson, Com. O. (Handsw'th) Wells, S. R.
Drewe, C. MacLaren, Andrew White, Lieut.-Col. Sir G. Dairymple
Elliot, Major Walter E. Meyer, Sir Frank Williams, A. M. (Cornwall, Northern)
Everard, W. Lindsay Monsell, Eyres, Com. Rt. Hon. B. M. Williams, Com. C. (Devon, Torquay)
Finburgh, S. Morris, R. H. Williams, Herbert G. (Reading)
Foxcroft, Captain C. T. Nelson, Sir Frank Womersley, W. J.
Frece, Sir Walter do Perring, sir William George
Gilmour, Lt.-Col. Rt. Hon. Sir John Peto, G. (Somerset, Frome) TELLERS FOR THE AYES.
Mr. Brocklebank and Sir Park Goff.
Adamson, Rt. Hon. W. (Fife, West) Hall, G. H. (Merthyr Tydvil) Ritson, J.
Adamson, W. M. (Stall., Cannock) Hayday, Arthur Roberts, Rt. Hon. F. O. (W. Bromwich)
Alexander, A. V. (Sheffield, Hillsbro) Henderson, Right Hon. A. (Burnley) Sakiatvala, Shapurji
Ammon, Charles George Henderson, T. (Glasgow) Scrymgeour, E.
Attlee, Clement Richard Hirst, G. H. Scurr, John
Baker, Walter Hudson, J. H. (Huddersfield) Shepherd, Arthur Lewis
Barker, G. (Monmouth, Abertillery) Hume, Sir G. H Shiels, Dr. Drummond
Batey, Joseph Jackson, Sir H. (Wandsworth, Cen'l) Shinwell, E.
Benn, Sir A. S. (Plymouth, Drake) Jenkins, W. (Glamorgan, Neath) Sitch, Charles H.
Bentinck, Lord Henry Cavendish John, William (Rhondda, West) Snell, Harry
Bondfield, Margaret Kelly, W. T. Snowden, Rt. Hon. Philip
Bourne, Captain Robert Croft Kennedy, T. Spender-Clay, Colonel H.
Broad, F. A. Kirkwood, D. Stamford, T. W.
Brown, Ernest (Leith) Lansbury, George Stephen, Campbell
Buchanan, G. Lawson, John James Stewart, J. (St. Rollox)
Campbell, E. T. Loder, J. de V. Sullivan, J.
Cape, Thomas Lowth, T. Sutton, J. E.
Charleton, H. C. Lumley, L. R. Thorne, W. (West Ham, Plaistow)
Compton, Joseph Lunn, William Tinker, John Joseph
Connolly, M. MacDonald, Rt. Hon. J. R. (Aberavon) Townend, A. E.
Cove, W. G. Mackinder, W. Varley, Frank B.
Dalton, Hugh March, S. Viant, S. P.
Davies, Rhys John (Westhoughton) Margesson, Captain D. Waterhouse, Captain Charles
Day, Harry Montague, Frederick Watts-Morgan, Lt.-Col. D. (Rhondda)
Dunnico, H. Morrison, R. C. (Tottenham, N.) Wellock, Wilfred
Edwards, C. (Monmouth, Bedwellty) Naylor, T. E. Whiteley, W.
Fielden, E. B. Newman, Sir R. H. S. D. L. (Exeter) Wilkinson, Ellen C.
Gibbins, Joseph Palin, John Henry Williams, T. (York, Don Valley)
Graham, Rt. Hon. Wm. (Edin., Cent.) Paling, W. Wilson, R. J. (Jarrow)
Greenwood, A. (Nelson and Colne) Parkinson, John Allen (Wigan) Wright, W.
Grenfell, D. R. (Glamorgan) Pethick-Lawrence, F. W. Young, Robert (Lancaster, Newton)
Grundy, T. W. Potts, John S.
Gunston, Captain D. W. Radford, E. A. TELLERS FOR THE NOES.
Hall, F. (York, W. R., Normanton) Richardson, R. (Houghton-le-Spring) Mr. Morgan Jones and Mr. Barr.